A A A
Avatar

Please consider registering
Guest

Search

— Forum Scope —






— Match —





— Forum Options —





Minimum search word length is 3 characters - maximum search word length is 84 characters

Register Lost password?
sp_Feed sp_PrintTopic sp_TopicIcon
D1 fork bush replacement - help !
Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
1
February 6, 2018 - 11:54 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I have seen several different fittings referred to. Some soldered [ where ? ] some not, some with spacer tubes / some not.

Mine appear to have a spacer tube which has a slot at the bottom to fit round the grease nipple and another hole about 1" further up and in line with the slot.

Logic tells me that there is a solder where the hole is in the spacer? If that's the case then I can locate the position of that hole and drill the solder out. I can't see any other reason why a hole would be in the spacer ? I have new bushes and seals ready to go in. Does everything come out through the bottom ? Does anyone know what size drift is required to take the bushes out ?

I enquired about having the bottom legs sized and hard chromed ..... £175 !! If ever I feel depressed and need a good laugh I'll ring them again.

I got a quote to have the leg replaced in Stainless and attached to the top / bottom fitting - £100 the pair.

Avatar
Blue Heeler
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 2543
Member Since:
November 16, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
2
February 6, 2018 - 6:35 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

The spacer tube is the easiest bit to remove,it just drops out when you`ve removed the fork tube end cap and lower bush.The hole you see in the spacer tube will marry up with the grease nipple.There is no need for this split spacer tube to be "soldered in",because it has to be free-floating to be nipped up between the top and bottom bushes when the end cap is wanged up(technical term).

Sometimes the bushes come out with ease and sometimes they are a pain.I have cut the bottom ones out carefully with a jigsaw,just shy of cutting into the tubes.I have knocked them out with a long drift.Don`t try and knock them out the top,as some folk have,you`ll knock the top locating ring off its tack-welded location.I have also made up a slide hammer with split collets.

I learned on here that the top fork bushes on D1 Rigid models were brazed in place.I have yet to strip mine,but my Plunger D1 forks have both bushes removable as per the following upside-down fork Bantams(D3/D5)

Yes,everything comes out through the bottom.

I seem to remember that the drift method I used on one of the fork jobs,was several long 1/2 socket extensions attached together,with the fat end locating on the top of the bottom bush.

Don`t forget to remove the grease nipples before proceeding with bush removal.

HTH

Blue

Avatar
Piquet
West Norfolk
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 1975
Member Since:
September 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
3
February 6, 2018 - 8:17 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I think the spacers are dual purpose, depending on the model/fittings, the grease nipple is fitted either at the bottom (usually with a retaining clip for the end cap) or (earlier models?) further up where it aligned with the centre hole in the spacer.

The top bushes were only soldered in on very early models.

I'm not a complete idiot ............................................ some parts are missing.

Avatar
neddyo
Guest
Guests
4
February 6, 2018 - 10:41 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I really like the idea of a split collet slide hammer.

Does the welded in locating ring have a larger or smaller inside diameter than the top bush?

My 1951 D1 lucas badly needs fork bushes.

Nick.

Avatar
Piquet
West Norfolk
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 1975
Member Since:
September 3, 2012
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
5
February 6, 2018 - 10:50 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I think it is slightly smaller than the top bush allowing you to just about get to the top edge of the bush.

Although the information is about D5 fork legs there is more information here

** Please log in to view **

and and illustration of the arrangement here

** Please log in to view **

and how the loose ring was fixed here

** Please log in to view **

The bush/spacer arrangement is identical on all D1, D3 & D5 forks apart from the aforementioned early D1 soldered top bush arrangement.

I'm not a complete idiot ............................................ some parts are missing.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
6
February 7, 2018 - 5:18 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Many thanx peeps for the quick response. I'm still wondering why there's a hole half way up the spacer ? I have a set of blind bearing pullers - I'll check the collet size on them - that WOULD be the easy way !

 

Can someone help me ident which model forks I have ? They didn't come on a a bike - and sorry to say fellas - not going back on one ! I'm using them as a basis for my Replica Boardtrack racer !!

 

The green mock up garden hose [ !! ] WILL be replaced with CDS tubing ! Just an off the wall thought - how about an extra bush in the middle where the spacer sits ?

 

Thanx again for your helpcafe-creme-010.jpgIMG_1442-1.JPGcafe-creme-016.jpgcafe-creme-009.jpg

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
7
February 7, 2018 - 5:21 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Forgot to ask - does anyone have a scrap frame [ damaged / rusty ] with the headstock intact ? If I could get a couple of foot of top and downtube that would be a bonus.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
8
February 10, 2018 - 3:26 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

I now have a headstock - and no complete frames were injured in any way during this process !! I can now move on to the final mock up and then it's a strip down and refurb everything. Thanx everyone for the info and feedback.

Avatar
Blue Heeler
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 2543
Member Since:
November 16, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
9
February 10, 2018 - 7:42 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

beachcomber550 said

Many thanx peeps for the quick response. I'm still wondering why there's a hole half way up the spacer ? I have a set of blind bearing pullers - I'll check the collet size on them - that WOULD be the easy way !

 Can someone help me ident which model forks I have ? They didn't come on a a bike - and sorry to say fellas - not going back on one ! I'm using them as a basis for my Replica Boardtrack racer !!

 The green mock up garden hose [ !! ] WILL be replaced with CDS tubing ! Just an off the wall thought - how about an extra bush in the middle where the spacer sits ?

 Thanx again for your help

Hole`s in spacer for grease.I have forks with the grease nipples lower down....and with them midway(my D1 and my D3)

Your wasted fork tubes were introduced with the D3 model.The D5 that followed were the same externally,from what I can see,but some changes internally.

An extra bush for what reason...to reduce the bottom legs flexing within the tubes?More drag/slower action/stiction though,it`s only steel tubing with grease helping sliding through phos-bronze.You could chrome your bottom legs?If you want to go down the extra bush route,you could take the length of a bush out of your spacers and have a bush-short spacer-bush-short spacer-bush arrangement,but you need to get grease in there,so another grease nipple or two?Special grease/polytetrafluoroethylene?

Looks like a KE125 front brake arm....same with the brake assy/wheel is it.

That extra shock is for those compression G`s you`ll be experiencing eh?Are you going to butcher the Bantam top yoke so the shock sits amidships?

What is the back end of the bike salvaged from?

Blue

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
10
February 10, 2018 - 10:40 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Blue, thanx for the ident.

I priced up hard chroming the lower legs £175 ..... I'm still laughing. re: the extra bush - yes to resist any flexing. I'm looking at the possibility of using a heavy duty hypoid type oil instead of grease. My forks have a grease nipple that fits through a slot in the bottom of the spacer tube. There is a hole about 1" further up in the spacer - but no corresponding grease nipple ?

The front wheel ass'y is Honda XL250 [ 21" ] - as is the rear [ 18" ]. The spindle hole just needed easing out a tad and the Honda wheel spindle drops right in. I've got some period look Mitas tyres in the relevant sizes.

I'd rather use "re-engineer " than "butcher", but yes the top yoke will be [ has been ] modified to allow the top pin fitting of the RAMSHOX unit to sit in the correct plane to ensure parallel motion of the springer front hoop. I could dispense with the Bantam spring and just use the monoshock as it will have all the adjustment I need. There will be a plate for the shock top to mount through. If I can find a tame machinist, I'll have one carved out of alloy to make a feature of it.

Back in the day when I as sprinting with my blown Triumph 500 with modified Bantam forks - I wasn't too concerned about self preservation ! However, the all up weight of this bike will be at least double that of a Bantam. It will see duty on the road and maybe on the Boardtrack circuits in Bielefeld [ Germany ]. And with something around 80 bhp - a little more power - so decent suspension is a given.

The lower frame cradle will be from the Kawasaki KZ750 twin [ as the power train ] and form the basis of the frame layout, but the rest of the frame will be a series of tubes to join up the dots.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
11
February 10, 2018 - 10:57 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

KZ750-sept-2017-007.jpgKZ750-sept-2017-008.jpg

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Blue Heeler
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 2543
Member Since:
November 16, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
12
February 12, 2018 - 12:45 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

What did you use to "re-engineer" that hole in the top yoke? 🙂

I`ve got some strange red "liquid grease" in a Castrol tin,kicking around somewhere from the `80s,forgotten the proper name of the stuff,used it in a vintage gearbox rebuild.Maybe that sort of stuff would do for your forks?

Once had a 7 year-old KZ750 twin in my stable,I was surprised what a nice bike it was to chuck around.Spent a bit of time fiddling around with the starter clutch mechanism,but apart from that it was very reliable.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
13
February 12, 2018 - 10:25 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Hi Blue,

actually - one step removed from butchered [ in engineering terms ] !! I just chomped out the bar that formed the "D"s using a 1/2" drill and angle grinder.! But don't despair - that was just so that i wouldn't hold up the final measuring when my pal came round to help. He's going to take it away to finish properly and then we want to make some sort of a feature [ maybe brass ? ] on the mounting plate. I have an original [ to the tank ] La Francaise Diamant headstock plaque - which would be hidden if I put it on the headstock tube - so I need to feature that somewhere. At least the measurements allowed us to determine that the special RAMSHOX unit I have will do the job [ in terms of packaging ], and the theory of the springer hoop front end works. Of course NOT my original idea at all !!! Similar in concept to the old H-D springer front ends .... except they looked very agricultural and fugly.

Do you know I ALSO had a tin of that Red stuff ! My Dad worked at [oh, better not ] and used to come home with all sorts of weird lubricants - some of which I still have 50 years on ! YKGrHqVHJ0E+Owq0j9BP9pDfI-sw60_12.jpgIMG_1280.JPGIMG_1277.JPGKZ750B-005.jpges, that's the kind of stuff I have in mind.The original grease nipple holes are being filled, and I'll probably drill / tap a couple of smaller holes - bottom one for a drain - and one to use as a filler level.

I rescued this KZ - it was 3 days away from the tip ! Everyone thought I was mad [ probably am ]. I paid £120 for it as the engine had been "re-freshed" by the PO. Then it was a case of «censored» mindedness when people started laughing ! My 60's Cafe Racer project is well advanced and has sprouted an Eaton supercharger.

The Boardtracker was something I'd been toying with for some years, and when the La Francaise Diamant tank came up for peanuts [ relatively ] - that was it. Not the first time I've built a project around one item ! The original Weber carb'ed KZ engine was lurking around looking for a home - be rude not to.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
14
February 14, 2018 - 11:42 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

And to cover up the "butchery" a brass plate [ in 3mm ] with a steel plate underneath to take the pin. I'm trying find someone who can etch the plate to match the "La Francaise Diamant" tank I'm using. 

It looks like 3 bushes per side will work OK and I'm waiting for a reply from the guy that supplied all my lubricant requirements to get back to me with a recommendation.

Anyone got a NOS or VGC fork stem top nut for sale ? 

Avatar
Blue Heeler
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 2543
Member Since:
November 16, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
15
February 14, 2018 - 10:24 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Interesting projects.

I wonder what the lube man will come up with.....will we all be putting something different in our grease guns to service our D1/3/5 forks....perhaps a PTFE-based product?

For your yoke stem nut,maybe pop a request in the Wanted section.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
16
February 15, 2018 - 11:27 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Blue,

thanx for your continued interest. Yes - we sometimes "stumble" across new and improved methods of doing things ! After all technology has marched on significantly since the early 50's ! I was amazed many years ago when I stripped a Burman gearbox to find it was packed with grease !

When I looked at the contact patches of the fork bottom I noticed the obvious wear patterns which left an area in the middle unscathed ..... that's where my 3rd bush will go. I was even considering one of the Lucas oil additives which work wonders with ailing gearboxes, diffs, and engines ! There is a trade off between lubrication qualities and mild "sticktion" - I'm assured that real IS a word !

As I will be cutting my springs down - does anyone want to do a p/x for a brand new pair ?

Here's the template for the brass cover. Notice the two holes which are out of line ! Must have been a Friday afternoon job at the BSA.

Thanx - I'll put an ad in the wanted section, also for the springs.IMG_1491.JPG

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
17
February 28, 2018 - 12:38 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

Springs now sorted thanx. Still waiting for a response from the impregnated Polypenco peeps. In the meantime, it will be at least 3 bushes per side. I have NO idea what the PO of the forks was playing at !! He's replaced the bushes on one side and then given up. He had managed to twist and BREAK both springs in the effort - then just loosely re-assembled the forks and sold them on ..... thanx pal.

Plan B then [ or is it C?] - I'll drill / tap for a drain plug at the bottom and ditto for a level hole. Just working out the volume of oil I can safely use. My man is recommending a light Hypoid type lubricant. Just waiting for my new best Irish friend to sort out a top stem nut and cover nut with hooter hole [ for my dampener rod ]. No rush Andy !

The front springer hoop has been finalised - just needs cutting to length when the springs have been shortened.bantam-forks-006.jpgIMG_1506.JPG

sp_PlupAttachments Attachments
Avatar
Blue Heeler
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 2543
Member Since:
November 16, 2011
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
18
February 28, 2018 - 8:47 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

You`ll need a pretty clever oil seal to keep that oil in place,wont you?

Avatar
cocorico
Central France
Top Gear User
Site Member
Forum Posts: 3367
Member Since:
June 23, 2013
sp_UserOfflineSmall Offline
19
March 1, 2018 - 7:39 am
sp_Permalink sp_Print

This is looking less like a D1 fork bush replacement topic and more like a hybrid build - shall I move it? dunno

 

Edit - now moved to Hybrid section.

Avatar
beachcomber550
Guest
Guests
20
March 1, 2018 - 1:16 pm
sp_Permalink sp_Print

cocorico said
This is looking less like a D1 fork bush replacement topic and more like a hybrid build - shall I move it? dunno  

Certainly if you feel it is appropriate... just tell me where !!!

Forum Timezone: Europe/London

Most Users Ever Online: 223

Currently Online: potbank, ZZ, Sponge, rhi010, Jamy
11 Guest(s)

Currently Browsing this Page:
1 Guest(s)

Top Posters:

cocorico: 3367

Cornish Rooster: 3109

bart: 2687

Blue Heeler: 2543

David Dale: 2346

Sprung Chicken: 2293

Piquet: 1975

Mags 1: 1853

sunny: 1738

jess steele: 1672

Newest Members:

Peter Turner

Forum Stats:

Groups: 9

Forums: 48

Topics: 11143

Posts: 98693

 

Member Stats:

Guest Posters: 1434

Members: 3207

Moderators: 0

Admins: 3

Administrators: Bantam-Super, JMD, Stoo63