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D14/4 Starting problem.
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mark g
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May 11, 2020 - 10:09 pm
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I have just completed a full ground up nut & bolt rebuild including engine rebuild on my D14/4.  After a bit of coaxing and a bump start I got the bike running, I completed a full set up, carb adjustments, checked timing with a timing light etc,etc.The engine revs freely and runs well, no power problems.  The only problem is it won’t start from cold.  I have tried every conceivable starting technique, no strangler, full strangler.  Used tickler, no tickler, no throttle, half, full, you name it I have tried it, but no go.  Give it a good push and a bump start and it’s away.

The only thing is the spark looks a bit weak.  I have tried a new coil, checked wiring etc, I am not quite sure how good a spark you get with a 6v positive earth system, however it runs.  I have checked everything multiple times and checked again.  I am now out of ideas.

If anyone has any ideas I would be grateful, as I am very cheesed off and also knackered from pushing the «censored» thing! 🥵🥵🥵

Thanks in advance.

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Blue Heeler
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May 11, 2020 - 11:24 pm
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Nice work.

Condenser soaking up too much power from the c/b points to get it started with the kicker? Bung an old car one on and try.

Try without the plug cap.

Run in the dark & look for sparks tracking. Not uncommon to see the coil sending a spark to the frame etc. Has happened to me & others on here.

Of course if I suggest electrics, it`ll be fuel. Good thread on here the other month on the pilot circuit drillings on the 626 carb & how easily it gets blocked. Think there`s a yourtube vid on it too. Not happened to my D14s....yet, but probably will next time I drag them out after a lay-off?

The list is endless. You fitted new crank seals on good shafts & the correct way around...didn`t follow popular youtube vid where chap fits them back-to-front? Usually will still run, after a fashion...

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Anthiron
Sunshine Coast QLD Australia
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May 12, 2020 - 12:49 am
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I’m pretty new to bantams but I’ve played these games before.

 

- check your earths are solid. Use a multimeter to check whether your battery voltage drops if you move the positive terminal of your multimeter to different locations around the frame.

- is your battery fully charged? 

- pull your plug, let it sit against the head to earth out and kick the bike with the ignition on. Do you get a nice fat blue spark or a weak orange or yellow spark?

- have you tried turning the idle speed screw in a couple of turns?. Sometimes when my 350 has been sitting and it’s a cold morning I need to give it a bit more idle speed which I then back off when it’s running. 

1969 BSA Bantam B175
2004 Harley Davidson Sportster
1998 Suzuki DR350
2007 Suzuki DR650SE
Grand Prix 160cc Victa Mini Bike

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JustinW
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May 12, 2020 - 7:00 am
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In the first instance I'd give it a decent run in the real world. You may find certain traits which help point to the underlying problem. For example misfiring or lacking power on hills. Plus you'll have a bit of fun and remind yourself while you are doing this in the first place.

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KC1961
Central Scotland
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May 12, 2020 - 5:15 pm
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My D14 was also v difficult to start from cold, the colder the weather the more kicks needed (3-4 dozen in the depths of the Scottish winter). A mate asked me how much I tickled it, I told him I tickled it until the fuel started to run out. He said to tickle it for a further 5-10 seconds. Problem solved. 

Sixteen guys entered the elevator at the same time,

That can only mean that I must be the man in the jar.

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sunny
Norfolk
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May 12, 2020 - 5:51 pm
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  the  trble   is  each  bantam  has its own  Qwerks    so  try  going  the way   from  above       new   plug ,  condecer  &  clean  &set  carb  

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Sponge
Lancashire (A chip shop somewhere near Preston)
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May 12, 2020 - 5:54 pm
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Having been through this rigmarole with a B175 in the past I have sympathy - but this is what I learned : 

Two additional things to check - if you have a weak spark :

Plug - does it have an 'R' in its number - this implies a resistor in the plug - change it for a non-resistor type (no 'R' in its number),  and try again

Plug cap - is this a resistor type as well - change it for a non resistor type and try again

You will generally get away with one resistor in your ignition line - but two will cause weak ( or no ) spark and starting problems 

Coil connections - it is possible to wire your coil the wrong way round - it will stil produce a spark but not a good one. Swap teh connection sover and try again. 

Only change one thing at a time - in this way you will know what caused the original problem. 

Sponge

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mark g
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May 14, 2020 - 9:40 pm
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Thanks everyone for your advice and comments, I now have a list for the weekend, hopefully be starting first kick by Sunday evening fingers-crossed thank-you

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Sponge
Lancashire (A chip shop somewhere near Preston)
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May 15, 2020 - 3:52 pm
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Hi Mark, 

I doubt it will ever start first kick from cold - usually the first one primes the crankcases with mixture - 2nd kick is good.  Good luck and don't forget to drink lots of tea - it really helps !!!

Sponge 

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Lone Wolf
The Black Country
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May 18, 2020 - 11:33 pm
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Wotcha.

Here's the "instructions" I gave to the fellow who bought my B 175.

^..^

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BantamBaz
Reading Berkshire
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May 20, 2020 - 10:03 pm
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I'd agree with the wolf.

Back in the day I had a Golden Arrow (sadly I sold it ) & the staring ritual was always, Fuel on, no ignition, 2 or 3 kicks & turn on ignition. Never failed to start on the first kick then.

I've had my D14 off the road since I bought it 18 months ago. used the Arrow technique today & away it went on second kick.

Barrie.

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BantamBaz
Reading Berkshire
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May 29, 2020 - 10:30 am
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Morning all.

My elation was a bit short lived, went out to start the other morning & would it fire? no chance, did a quick check of the electrics, timing etc. took the plug out & it was wet & oiled. So had a back track to when it started ok & realised that I had previously turned off the fuel & let it stall out with no fuel in the carb. So maybe that's my problem. 

With the plug cleaned & a tickle,away it went !

Fuel off & stalled out, so we'll see what next time brings ?

Barrie.

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mikef
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May 29, 2020 - 11:05 am
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Hi Barrie.
       The starting problem seems much like the trouble that I have just had for the second time.
The problem has been with a leaking fuel tap. The tap does not shut off completely due to a worn cork inside.
Fuel then slowly fills the carb and eventually gets past the float shut off needle. Fuel then seeps into the crankcase via the inlet port.
The first kick when you try to start immediately wets the spark plug.
My first replacement tap cork lasted 6 years, the second has only lasted 2 years.
In my case I think the reason for cork failure is a missing gauze filter on the fuel tap itself. It had probably broken off many years ago.
I didn't really worry about it too much as there is a good filter in the banjo inlet of the carb and I had never had a blocked jet problem.
Unfortunately any sediment in the tank can get into the tap and my guess is it eventually wears the cork.
I have now replaced the gauze filter, I found a supplier on e-bay. They are sold as Seagull outboard motor tap filters but are identical to the Ewarts tap filters. They are soldered in. A very easy job if you follow the supplied instructions.
So I have now replaced the cork and filter. Hopefully problem solved for a few years.
Mike.

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b175er
saltfleetby
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May 29, 2020 - 12:06 pm
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I think they often leak a little when they're stood. Maybe kick it first without using the tickler.

two B175s and a CB360

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